asifsyed's review against another edition
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? It's complicated
- Loveable characters? It's complicated
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? It's complicated
4.0
Graphic: Classism, Colonisation, Racial slurs, Racism, Cultural appropriation, Xenophobia, Toxic relationship, Child abuse, Emotional abuse, and Domestic abuse
Moderate: Violence, Murder, Trafficking, Fire/Fire injury, Addiction, Slavery, Misogyny, Grief, Drug abuse, and Gun violence
Minor: Torture, Police brutality, War, Abandonment, Terminal illness, Religious bigotry, Sexism, and Pandemic/Epidemic
rinku's review against another edition
- Plot- or character-driven? A mix
- Strong character development? Yes
- Loveable characters? It's complicated
- Diverse cast of characters? It's complicated
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
3.5
Spoiler
Robin killed his father and they had to hide his body, this whole section stressed me so muchSpoiler
low point with Ramy getting shot, Hermes destroyed, and Robin and Victoire locked up. It was such a great moment when Griffin saved them but of course, he had to die as well. This part of the story was so dark, and I loved itSpoiler
Robin and Victorie took over the tower. It showed that non-violence can’t be the answer if you want to change something and deals with the moral questions around political violence. After it, it was so interesting to see how the city started to fall apart and how the revolution started. Sadly, the worker revolution wasn’t talked about in depth as I wished it wasSpoiler
the tower getting destroyed and Robin having to prepare for his death, I always love moments like these in novels lmaoSpoiler
helped Ramy and Victorie flee and got punished instead of them. Before, I hadn’t the feeling that he was the kind of guy to do something like thisSpoiler
she turns out to be a traitor as well in the endGraphic: Racism, Child abuse, Colonisation, Gun violence, Murder, Racial slurs, Torture, Violence, Addiction, Blood, Sexism, Alcohol, Misogyny, Classism, Confinement, Death, Death of parent, and Drug abuse
Moderate: Medical content, War, Religious bigotry, Fire/Fire injury, Pandemic/Epidemic, Suicidal thoughts, and Toxic friendship
samchase112's review against another edition
- Plot- or character-driven? A mix
- Strong character development? Yes
- Loveable characters? It's complicated
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
5.0
Full review coming soon, even if it’s just mainly just going to be a list of quotes.
Graphic: Drug abuse, Violence, Classism, Toxic friendship, Torture, Slavery, Sexism, Grief, Colonisation, Physical abuse, Emotional abuse, Suicide, Pandemic/Epidemic, Racism, Blood, Racial slurs, Xenophobia, Death of parent, Death, and Child abuse
Moderate: Vomit, Suicidal thoughts, War, Fire/Fire injury, Car accident, and Addiction
Minor: Child death and Rape
lilmor's review
- Plot- or character-driven? A mix
- Strong character development? Yes
- Loveable characters? It's complicated
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? It's complicated
5.0
Graphic: Death of parent, Gore, Murder, Abandonment, Grief, Racism, Physical abuse, Violence, Classism, Colonisation, Death, and Racial slurs
Moderate: Police brutality, Slavery, Toxic friendship, Suicidal thoughts, Blood, Body horror, Emotional abuse, Misogyny, War, Alcohol, Drug abuse, Fire/Fire injury, Sexism, Torture, Addiction, and Violence
bookedandbusy's review against another edition
- Plot- or character-driven? A mix
- Strong character development? It's complicated
- Loveable characters? It's complicated
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? No
4.5
Graphic: Drug use, Drug abuse, Grief, Injury/Injury detail, Toxic friendship, Alcoholism, Fire/Fire injury, Hate crime, Addiction, Classism, Alcohol, Blood, Bullying, Pandemic/Epidemic, Gun violence, Torture, Violence, Confinement, Death, Death of parent, and Excrement
spineofthesaurus's review
- Plot- or character-driven? A mix
- Strong character development? Yes
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
5.0
Graphic: Injury/Injury detail, Racial slurs, Racism, Self harm, Suicidal thoughts, Toxic friendship, Alcohol, Child abuse, Blood, Colonisation, Violence, Xenophobia, Classism, Death of parent, Death, Gun violence, Hate crime, Medical trauma, War, Body horror, Confinement, Forced institutionalization, Gaslighting, Gore, Grief, Sexual harassment, Suicide, Torture, Emotional abuse, Murder, and Physical abuse
Moderate: Cultural appropriation, Genocide, Vomit, Fire/Fire injury, Homophobia, Mass/school shootings, Misogyny, Police brutality, Religious bigotry, Abandonment, Deportation, Islamophobia, Medical content, Slavery, Terminal illness, Ableism, Child death, Chronic illness, Drug abuse, Drug use, Kidnapping, Sexism, and Trafficking
Minor: Excrement, Infidelity, Car accident, Alcoholism, and Addiction
anastashamarie's review
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? It's complicated
- Loveable characters? It's complicated
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
5.0
📙 This review is going to be a doozy. I have a lot of thoughts after this one. As literary fiction exploring the ugly sides of British colonialism and academia, this work is a masterpiece; it's a well-done character study of the pressures and pain of marginalized populations trying to fit into a world that doesn't feel like it wants them. As a work of speculative fantasy (or as a fantasy novel in general), from a storytelling perspective, I have some complaints. But, the method isn't the point and never was, so I've decided that a 5-star review is probably most accurate when I consider this work for what it was meant to be, rather than what I wanted it to be.
📗 I feel like I should start by saying: This is not the story to read if you are trying to escape from the harsh realities of our world. It throws them at you repeatedly, in both subtle and undeniable ways. As a white woman in academia, I'm going to be honest and say this was at times profoundly uncomfortable to read...which is exactly what it was meant to be. To again go with honesty, there were times that the thought crossed my mind that I didn't need to finish this, that I didn't have to spend my weekend feeling angry on behalf of fictional people living these real life injustices. And that's a privilege that needs acknowledged, for there are so many people who can't just "turn off the audiobook" so to speak, not when these stories so closely mirror their daily experience.
📕 R.F. Kuang does an excellent job of keeping the reader engaged despite this discomfort, which is a feat of its own, but is also a terrible contradiction when considering that the overarching moral of this story is to encourage listening to understand, not to respond. Much the same as even writing a review to try to convey my experience also feels antithetical, as this is not a book designed to entertain, but a book to convey emotion and an experience. Yet I still found myself oscillating between being disappointed in the story structure while being blown away by the rhetoric throughout most of the book. So take where's hereafter for what you will; it's far less important than the rest that I've already said.
📘 Do I think this book was unnecessarily long and at times heavy handed? Yes. Do I wish it had a more satisfying conclusion that actually answered the titles promise to explore the necessity of violence? Also yes. But I also feel like it delivers incredibly well in the way that it conveys its broader themes and morals. Let me explain.
For a book about the power of words, this delivers in it's precise use of them to convey it's point and I think, for the most part, does so most successfully at the micro level. I understood fully why the characters did or did not find necessity in violence themselves, how their tragedies unfolded, and why hope may have still remained despite it all. But I think where we're left to struggle is to see if violence was actually something that made a difference on the macro level. For writing that hammered points over the reader's head at times, there is no actual discussion of whether the broad end justifies the means, because we don't actually see a macro level end in the books, just a micro level end for the characters. Maybe that's the point; maybe the purpose is just that we're if we truly listen to characters who never felt heard and that the story HAS to end with them. The existentialist part of me loves the idea that individual meaning trumps the universal experience. The collectivist part kind of hates the idea that only we alone matter in the end. Regardless, especially as a fantasy reader, the loose ends are tough for me.
Now, I don't mind ambiguity in a book in general. In fact, I think particularly in books that dive into social issues, nuance is crucial for understanding. This book approaches that nuance incredibly holistically in that it is very precisely, clearly delivered. I think this in part comes from the author's academic career and in part to convey the underlying need to be precise and clear in an attempt to be understood. I just wish the author would have either backed off this directness throughout OR carried it through all the way to the end. Make the point, however unpalatable, or leave it up to the reader to infer entirely. (But I again feel like I should acknowledge that may be easier said than done.)
📚 In the end, I can only truly speak to my experience of this work, as it exists through my own biases and experiences. I hope that honors Kuang's intentions with this story, and I hope that others take the time to read her words. There are so many layers here that I'm sure I'll be unfurling for a while to come.
Graphic: Physical abuse, Racism, Religious bigotry, Slavery, Gun violence, Suicidal thoughts, War, Xenophobia, Child abuse, Violence, Islamophobia, Colonisation, Racial slurs, Suicide, Confinement, Forced institutionalization, Murder, Toxic friendship, Sexism, Sexual harassment, Torture, Gaslighting, Injury/Injury detail, Classism, Death, Death of parent, Emotional abuse, Grief, and Misogyny
Moderate: Addiction, Drug use, Genocide, Alcohol, Trafficking, Cultural appropriation, Fire/Fire injury, Hate crime, Drug abuse, and Kidnapping
saucy_bookdragon's review against another edition
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? Yes
- Loveable characters? Yes
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
5.0
When people ask me what my favorite books are this is going to be one of my answers
Graphic: Grief, Pandemic/Epidemic, Racial slurs, Racism, Suicide, Torture, Violence, Physical abuse, Classism, Cultural appropriation, Emotional abuse, Colonisation, Gaslighting, Gun violence, Injury/Injury detail, Islamophobia, Misogyny, Murder, Death, Death of parent, Gore, Sexism, Toxic friendship, and Xenophobia
Moderate: Drug use, Fire/Fire injury, Medical content, Sexual harassment, Blood, Religious bigotry, Child abuse, and Alcohol
talonsontypewriters's review against another edition
- Plot- or character-driven? A mix
- Strong character development? Yes
- Loveable characters? Yes
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
5.0
Graphic: Classism, Gun violence, Murder, Death of parent, Injury/Injury detail, Grief, Sexism, Xenophobia, Torture, Physical abuse, Colonisation, Death, Suicidal thoughts, Fire/Fire injury, Suicide, Misogyny, Child abuse, Emotional abuse, Police brutality, Violence, and Racism
Moderate: Gore, Confinement, War, Cultural appropriation, Islamophobia, Sexual harassment, Drug use, Slavery, Religious bigotry, and Pandemic/Epidemic
Minor: Vomit, Child death, Alcohol, and Addiction
giulianalb99's review against another edition
- Plot- or character-driven? A mix
- Strong character development? Yes
- Loveable characters? Yes
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? It's complicated
3.5
El mensaje que quiere transmitir la autora con este libro sí que me ha parecido súper bueno, además que en el libro ves cómo los personajes son tratados y estereotipados por sus razas/colores de piel, así como una misoginia tremenda hacia las mujeres que, por desgracia, aún sigue pasando. Los personajes me han encantado, sobretodo Victoire y Ramy, y me encanta cómo la autora ha plasmado a Letty para representar lo que una persona blanca nunca podría llegar a entender (la razón por la cual llevaron a cabo el desmantelamiento de los planes que tenían entre manos los profesores de Babel con respecto a China) básicamente porque nunca ha tenido que pasar por racismo.
Aunque yo tenía otras expectativas, no es un libro para nada malo, pero ha habido veces que se me ha hecho insufrible, y no es hasta más de la mitad del libro que empiezan a pasar cosas interesantes. Lo del tema de la traducción me ha parecido bastante interesante, eso sí. A eso me refiero a lo de mi relación toxica, porque me parece un libro súper pesado pero que está increíblemente escrito.
Por supuesto, leeré más libros de R. F. Kuang. La verdad sea dicha: ella es increíble.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The toxic relationship I have with this book is inexplicable. I bought it because of all the hype it had and from the synopsis it seemed like a pretty interesting book. It took me a while to get to it because I had other books on my tbr, but after a few months, I was finally able to read it. The truth is that the author writes incredibly well, her pen is amazing. I know perfectly well that it is a historical fiction book but I had been told that it was a a dark academia with a lot of magic (Harry Potter-ish vibes) but it wasn’t like that at all. On some occasions it even seemed like I was reading my high school history book and the truth is that that disappointed me a bit, since magic appears much less than I thought and honestly, there’s information that could have been omitted from the book (because, in my opinion, it had more pages than needed) and it could’ve been much shorter.
The message that the author wants to transmit with this book is incredible, in addition to the fact that in the book you see how the characters are treated and stereotyped because of their race/skin color, as well as a tremendous misogyny towards women which unfortunately it's still happening. I loved almost all the characters, especially Victoire and Ramy, and I love how the author wrote Letty to represent what a white person could never understand (the reason why they carried out the dismantling of the plans of the Babel professors regarding China) basically because they’ve never had to go through racism.
Although I had other expectations, it's not a bad book at all, but there were times when I found it insufferable, and it's not until more than halfway through the book that interesting things start to happen. However, all the translation stuff was quite interesting to me. That's what I mean about my toxic relationship with it, because it’s such a dense book but it's incredibly written.
Of course, I will read more books by R. F. Kuang. Truth be told: she is amazing.
Graphic: Grief, Hate crime, Misogyny, Murder, Racism, Blood, Classism, Confinement, Fire/Fire injury, Slavery, Torture, War, Xenophobia, Gun violence, Cultural appropriation, Death, Forced institutionalization, Racial slurs, Suicide, Violence, Colonisation, Death of parent, Emotional abuse, Gaslighting, Mental illness, Sexism, Toxic friendship, Physical abuse, and Islamophobia
Moderate: Alcohol and Suicide attempt
Minor: Drug use