jazzwerewolf's review against another edition
adventurous
inspiring
tense
medium-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? A mix
- Loveable characters? No
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
4.25
alice_digest's review against another edition
I am a huge sci-fi fan on TV, movies, video games and even the occasional comic book.. but I've never really read any real sci-fi novels other than Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy (aside from your classic HG Wells stuff and the more "literary" end, e.g. Atwood, Cloud Atlas etc). Definitely no Space Opera (other than HHGTG).
I had heard people recommend the Culture novels, and I'd read and been impressed (and a bit disturbed) by The Wasp Factory (as Iain Banks) so I though I'd give Iain M. Banks a go.
Honestly.. I completely failed to see what people have got to excited about here. I must be missing something.
I have it a good go.. I got about half way through when I realised it was a real chore, and it was feeling much more like punishment than entertainment.. And life is too short to waste on bad books!
The main issue (although there are a few!) is that I didn't like or care about a single one of the characters. I wouldn't say there is any characterisation really.. you get descriptions of characters and maybe a list of traits but you never know them beyond that, they never seem to demonstrate their personalities. They have no defined motivations! Horza.. our "hero" (?) .. I didn't even like him! I don't think I know him well enough see beyond the fact that he is violent and he seems to lack any kind of moral code (good or bad). He is doing what he is doing because he doesn't like the Culture.. but why doesn't he? Does he even know? A character challenges him on it at one point and I can't remember him giving an even vaguely convincing reason. (excellent time to put forward your arguments Banks.. Oh no, maybe not then). Just.. Culture is bad, Horza doesn't like them.
This is also a shame because since he is a Changer and can change his physical appearance.. this could have been a chance to explore some interesting stuff on identity. But no, he's a cardboard cutout action hero type (maybe anti-hero? I don't know, I didn't get him at all!).
The Culture don't sound that bad to me! Ok they meddle in other civilisations, and then have big powerful warships... but other than they sound pretty cool and chilled out!
This book is also TOO LONG by FAR. There is. So. Much. Boring. Description. Far more than is needed! It's distracting, it takes away from the plot (what plot there is). It's too detailed and it's dull. I get the temptation - you come up with this vast imagined universe, you want to tell people about it - but there are more effective ways to demonstrate far more succinctly! I was skipping huge chunks, even pages, out in the end.. hoping it would get better (** Spoiler: It didn't **)
There is a lot of action too. Ok that can be cool - but not if I don't care about a single one of the characters or really understand why (or what) they are fighting for in the first place!
Bits I liked. I liked the Minds, they were interesting. I like the tongue-in-cheek names of ships. I liked a lot of the general concepts and the idea of the Culture etc .. Just I was disappointed it was so poorly executed.
All in all, I was so disappointed by this book! I really wanted to love it.
Strange too because The Wasp Factory is incredible, and I have Frank, and his family, so burnt into my mind now! I thought that writing might have translated into his Sci-Fi.
I don't want to let this put me off trying out more Sci-Fi novels.
I wonder if it's because I'm female? I definitely need to LIKE the characters, I need some kind of emotional investment in them.
I had heard people recommend the Culture novels, and I'd read and been impressed (and a bit disturbed) by The Wasp Factory (as Iain Banks) so I though I'd give Iain M. Banks a go.
Honestly.. I completely failed to see what people have got to excited about here. I must be missing something.
I have it a good go.. I got about half way through when I realised it was a real chore, and it was feeling much more like punishment than entertainment.. And life is too short to waste on bad books!
The main issue (although there are a few!) is that I didn't like or care about a single one of the characters. I wouldn't say there is any characterisation really.. you get descriptions of characters and maybe a list of traits but you never know them beyond that, they never seem to demonstrate their personalities. They have no defined motivations! Horza.. our "hero" (?) .. I didn't even like him! I don't think I know him well enough see beyond the fact that he is violent and he seems to lack any kind of moral code (good or bad). He is doing what he is doing because he doesn't like the Culture.. but why doesn't he? Does he even know? A character challenges him on it at one point and I can't remember him giving an even vaguely convincing reason. (excellent time to put forward your arguments Banks.. Oh no, maybe not then). Just.. Culture is bad, Horza doesn't like them.
This is also a shame because since he is a Changer and can change his physical appearance.. this could have been a chance to explore some interesting stuff on identity. But no, he's a cardboard cutout action hero type (maybe anti-hero? I don't know, I didn't get him at all!).
The Culture don't sound that bad to me! Ok they meddle in other civilisations, and then have big powerful warships... but other than they sound pretty cool and chilled out!
This book is also TOO LONG by FAR. There is. So. Much. Boring. Description. Far more than is needed! It's distracting, it takes away from the plot (what plot there is). It's too detailed and it's dull. I get the temptation - you come up with this vast imagined universe, you want to tell people about it - but there are more effective ways to demonstrate far more succinctly! I was skipping huge chunks, even pages, out in the end.. hoping it would get better (** Spoiler: It didn't **)
There is a lot of action too. Ok that can be cool - but not if I don't care about a single one of the characters or really understand why (or what) they are fighting for in the first place!
Bits I liked. I liked the Minds, they were interesting. I like the tongue-in-cheek names of ships. I liked a lot of the general concepts and the idea of the Culture etc .. Just I was disappointed it was so poorly executed.
All in all, I was so disappointed by this book! I really wanted to love it.
Strange too because The Wasp Factory is incredible, and I have Frank, and his family, so burnt into my mind now! I thought that writing might have translated into his Sci-Fi.
I don't want to let this put me off trying out more Sci-Fi novels.
I wonder if it's because I'm female? I definitely need to LIKE the characters, I need some kind of emotional investment in them.
bahbadook's review against another edition
adventurous
dark
mysterious
reflective
sad
tense
slow-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Plot
- Strong character development? No
- Loveable characters? It's complicated
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
3.75
<strong>Middle third was amazing</strong>
The first quarter or so of the book was almost unbearably slow. I had to fight to get that far. And then it got a little more interesting. And then at the third mark, things started intensifying and got real interesting. And the momentum kept up for a good third and then it slowed way back down. And then it kicked back up and while the events were definitely worth high tension but I just wasn't feeling it.
And I was just disappointed by the end.
Which is a shame because that middle third was stunning. If the whole book had been like that, easy five stars. Easy.
I only hated one character. I don't think I loved any of them. But I did like our main character. Horza was an interesting person. And I like that the epilogue had things that weren't entirely spelled out. I'm still thinking about the implications of that penultimate bit.
And I liked the writing style. I'll probably read more of the series, now that I know what to expect. At least to give him a chance to redeem himself after that ending.
The first quarter or so of the book was almost unbearably slow. I had to fight to get that far. And then it got a little more interesting. And then at the third mark, things started intensifying and got real interesting. And the momentum kept up for a good third and then it slowed way back down. And then it kicked back up and while the events were definitely worth high tension but I just wasn't feeling it.
And I was just disappointed by the end.
Which is a shame because that middle third was stunning. If the whole book had been like that, easy five stars. Easy.
I only hated one character. I don't think I loved any of them. But I did like our main character. Horza was an interesting person. And I like that the epilogue had things that weren't entirely spelled out. I'm still thinking about the implications of that penultimate bit.
And I liked the writing style. I'll probably read more of the series, now that I know what to expect. At least to give him a chance to redeem himself after that ending.
mraymer9's review against another edition
2.0
Interesting ideas bogged down by thin characters and overly abstruse descriptions of technology. Could have been edited down to half the length. Ideology of the Culture is fascinating, but not present enough to make up for the book's other shortcomings. Good, decidedly bleak ending.
stephilica's review against another edition
3.0
I have a love-hate relationship with this book. I love a great deal of it, but the things I hate are so pervasive as well.
The galaxy is amazingly built. The cultures (and the Culture, ha!) are beautifully examined, though there are some asides that I really didn’t want to know about… Social and religious conflicts, technological innovation, and scientific wonders pervade. It’s the main reason I kept reading; every time I considered putting the book down, Banks amazed with another novel idea. While some of the long diatribes about philosophy felt gratuitous, the examination of different cultures’ points of view showed the strength of the world building; Banks went beyond superficial aesthetics and created genuine alien cultures.
The prose too can be gorgeous. Take this:
Against a wall of pure white towering higher than the Olmedreca’s tallest spire, the Megaship was throwing itself to destruction in a froth of debris and ice. It was like the biggest wave in the universe, rendered in scrap metal, sculpted in grinding junk; and beyond and about it, over and through, cascades of flashing, glittering ice and snow swept down in great snow veils from the cliff of frozen water beyond.
Or even this:
The mountain on the island grew larger very slowly. He felt as though he was building it, as though the effort required to make it appear larger in his sight was the same as if he was toiling to construct that peak; heap it up rock by rock, with his own hands...
While beautiful in places, though, it’s also obfuscating. The prologue itself was difficult to get through and is a rather accurate sample of the rest of the novel. Various terms are thrown out and readers are expected to piece meanings together, or infer from context; while I actually enjoy such academic exercises while reading, there were times that it made understanding what’s going on nearly impossible. Furthermore, there are places where the prose is so thick and detailed that it detracts from the action of the moment, and others when I really wanted more explanation and received bare-bones.
There are also moments of complete info-dump. There’s pages and pages on the initial crew of the CAT that throws a few personality traits and their appearances at me, and then I’m expected to care for these characters as they show little to any of the listed traits before fading out of the narrative. It didn’t work. I had to keep flipping back to remind myself who half the crew members even were. Another example was the opening of a chapter that takes place during a game of Damage, which is actually a very interesting idea, and perhaps one of my favorite parts of the novel. The chapter opens, however, with a reporter waxing lyrical about the game… while we still have no idea what it is, just that it’s a card game of sorts. It’s only several pages later that we receive an explanation as to the rules—which, admittedly, are hard-core.
The plot also swims around for a bit without going anywhere, and coupled with the prose, can be difficult to follow. It’s also slooowwwww. There are a few ‘wtf’ moments, but at least they were interesting compared to slogging to get there.
And lastly, I hated the characters. Nearly every single one. I liked the Idirans, even with their sense of superiority to ‘mortal’ lifeforms. They’re also freaking cool aliens, and the idea of them and their anthropomorphic (but not really) appearance stuck with me. I also liked Balveda, and she’s hilarious, but mostly because I hated Horza. It is not good to hate the main character, but Horza has little empathy for those around him, has such a strong hatred of the Culture that it’s impossible for him to see any nuance in certain situations, and murders often. We don’t know most of his motivations, just that he hates the Culture because he believes them an end to evolution. Horza is nonreligious and otherwise doesn’t seem concerned with the fate of the human race, so I wonder why this rankles him so. Not only that, at times he seems to have little to no empathy for others, and at other times he’s extremely concerned about their fates.
He wondered how Culture people faced the war; they were supposed to be able to decide to die, too, though it was said to be more complicated than simple poison. But how did they resist it, those soft, peace-pampered souls? He imagined them in combat, auto-euthanizing almost the instant the first shots landed, the first wounds started to appear. The thought made him smile.
Ladies and gentleman, our ‘hero.’ Even Jorg Ancranth felt bad about the people he killed. Horza claims he has no qualms about killing Culture; he even thinks he should kill Balveda multiple times—so the question remains, why didn't he? His motivation about wondering how the others perceive him rings false; he hadn't particularly cared up to that point.
Balveda, at the least, has her own set of internally consistent morals. Fal and Jase were also super cute, Unaha-Closp is funny, Yalson occasionally made me care (but only occasionally), and the Mind was an interesting examination of self and the idea of knowing the self.
I’m also slightly irritated at the condescending tone towards religion. Horza goes on and on about how much he thinks religion is irrational, and every religious character is portrayed as overly superstitious and a buffoon. He states he has a similar opinion on the matter as the Culture, so I suppose that’s their one common ground. However, some discussions were interesting enough, and Horza seems to be at least examining different points of view at times:
Horza didn’t believe in the Idirans’ religion any more than Balveda had, and indeed he could see in its over-deliberate, too-planned ideals exactly the sort of life-constricting forces he so despised in the Culture’s initially more benign ethos. But the Idirans relied on themselves, not on their machines, and so they were still part of life. To him, that made all the difference.
(Horza has an issue not with higher powers, though he doesn’t believe in them, but in reliance upon them)
“You’re just a hunk of meat. That’s all anybody is. Just meat. And anyway,” he kicked Horza again, “pain isn’t real. Just chemicals and electrics and that sort of thing, right?”
“Oh,” Horza croaked, his wounds aching briefly, “yes. Right.”
(Horza is confronted with the implications of his beliefs; is there more to the human experience than neuroscience and chemical messaging?)
That’s the first 300 pages. The last 200 are amazing. On their own, four stars. Pacing picked up immensely, and tension, characterization, and action became more fluid—but it wasn’t quite enough to fully save this book, since I had to slog through 300 pages to get there.
The galaxy is amazingly built. The cultures (and the Culture, ha!) are beautifully examined, though there are some asides that I really didn’t want to know about… Social and religious conflicts, technological innovation, and scientific wonders pervade. It’s the main reason I kept reading; every time I considered putting the book down, Banks amazed with another novel idea. While some of the long diatribes about philosophy felt gratuitous, the examination of different cultures’ points of view showed the strength of the world building; Banks went beyond superficial aesthetics and created genuine alien cultures.
The prose too can be gorgeous. Take this:
Against a wall of pure white towering higher than the Olmedreca’s tallest spire, the Megaship was throwing itself to destruction in a froth of debris and ice. It was like the biggest wave in the universe, rendered in scrap metal, sculpted in grinding junk; and beyond and about it, over and through, cascades of flashing, glittering ice and snow swept down in great snow veils from the cliff of frozen water beyond.
Or even this:
The mountain on the island grew larger very slowly. He felt as though he was building it, as though the effort required to make it appear larger in his sight was the same as if he was toiling to construct that peak; heap it up rock by rock, with his own hands...
While beautiful in places, though, it’s also obfuscating. The prologue itself was difficult to get through and is a rather accurate sample of the rest of the novel. Various terms are thrown out and readers are expected to piece meanings together, or infer from context; while I actually enjoy such academic exercises while reading, there were times that it made understanding what’s going on nearly impossible. Furthermore, there are places where the prose is so thick and detailed that it detracts from the action of the moment, and others when I really wanted more explanation and received bare-bones.
There are also moments of complete info-dump. There’s pages and pages on the initial crew of the CAT that throws a few personality traits and their appearances at me, and then I’m expected to care for these characters as they show little to any of the listed traits before fading out of the narrative. It didn’t work. I had to keep flipping back to remind myself who half the crew members even were. Another example was the opening of a chapter that takes place during a game of Damage, which is actually a very interesting idea, and perhaps one of my favorite parts of the novel. The chapter opens, however, with a reporter waxing lyrical about the game… while we still have no idea what it is, just that it’s a card game of sorts. It’s only several pages later that we receive an explanation as to the rules—which, admittedly, are hard-core.
The plot also swims around for a bit without going anywhere, and coupled with the prose, can be difficult to follow. It’s also slooowwwww. There are a few ‘wtf’ moments, but at least they were interesting compared to slogging to get there.
And lastly, I hated the characters. Nearly every single one. I liked the Idirans, even with their sense of superiority to ‘mortal’ lifeforms. They’re also freaking cool aliens, and the idea of them and their anthropomorphic (but not really) appearance stuck with me. I also liked Balveda, and she’s hilarious, but mostly because I hated Horza. It is not good to hate the main character, but Horza has little empathy for those around him, has such a strong hatred of the Culture that it’s impossible for him to see any nuance in certain situations, and murders often. We don’t know most of his motivations, just that he hates the Culture because he believes them an end to evolution. Horza is nonreligious and otherwise doesn’t seem concerned with the fate of the human race, so I wonder why this rankles him so. Not only that, at times he seems to have little to no empathy for others, and at other times he’s extremely concerned about their fates.
He wondered how Culture people faced the war; they were supposed to be able to decide to die, too, though it was said to be more complicated than simple poison. But how did they resist it, those soft, peace-pampered souls? He imagined them in combat, auto-euthanizing almost the instant the first shots landed, the first wounds started to appear. The thought made him smile.
Ladies and gentleman, our ‘hero.’ Even Jorg Ancranth felt bad about the people he killed. Horza claims he has no qualms about killing Culture; he even thinks he should kill Balveda multiple times—so the question remains, why didn't he? His motivation about wondering how the others perceive him rings false; he hadn't particularly cared up to that point.
Balveda, at the least, has her own set of internally consistent morals. Fal and Jase were also super cute, Unaha-Closp is funny, Yalson occasionally made me care (but only occasionally), and the Mind was an interesting examination of self and the idea of knowing the self.
I’m also slightly irritated at the condescending tone towards religion. Horza goes on and on about how much he thinks religion is irrational, and every religious character is portrayed as overly superstitious and a buffoon. He states he has a similar opinion on the matter as the Culture, so I suppose that’s their one common ground. However, some discussions were interesting enough, and Horza seems to be at least examining different points of view at times:
Horza didn’t believe in the Idirans’ religion any more than Balveda had, and indeed he could see in its over-deliberate, too-planned ideals exactly the sort of life-constricting forces he so despised in the Culture’s initially more benign ethos. But the Idirans relied on themselves, not on their machines, and so they were still part of life. To him, that made all the difference.
(Horza has an issue not with higher powers, though he doesn’t believe in them, but in reliance upon them)
“You’re just a hunk of meat. That’s all anybody is. Just meat. And anyway,” he kicked Horza again, “pain isn’t real. Just chemicals and electrics and that sort of thing, right?”
“Oh,” Horza croaked, his wounds aching briefly, “yes. Right.”
(Horza is confronted with the implications of his beliefs; is there more to the human experience than neuroscience and chemical messaging?)
That’s the first 300 pages. The last 200 are amazing. On their own, four stars. Pacing picked up immensely, and tension, characterization, and action became more fluid—but it wasn’t quite enough to fully save this book, since I had to slog through 300 pages to get there.
notesurfer's review against another edition
adventurous
dark
slow-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Plot
- Strong character development? No
- Loveable characters? No
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? No
3.0
Consider Phlebas is an imaginative space opera, but the writing leaves a lot to be desired. The many creatures, cultures, and technologies of Banks' universe are fascinating, if occasionally a bit contrived. Fans of Star Wars will appreciate the mixture of humans, modified humans, machines, and exotic aliens that populate the setting. Likewise there is a film writer's sensibility of pace and action, with many extensive chases, combats, and so on.
For me these action sequences became almost immediately tiresome, drawing attention to a writer's idiom that is prevalent throughout. Every scene feels like a storyboard rather than a novel. An exaggerated example: "Bob ran 100 meters down the hall, then turned his head at a 45 degree angle, missing the 10 meter drop into the darkness by a mere meter." Admittedly these storyboards are more evocative than that, but I still find this type of writing exhausting. On top of that the book seems to think that it is a biting critique of war, all while glorying in the capability and heroism of its characters. Banks has a lot of cool ideas, but his delivery flooded me with unnecessary details that ended up drowning out everything else.
For me these action sequences became almost immediately tiresome, drawing attention to a writer's idiom that is prevalent throughout. Every scene feels like a storyboard rather than a novel. An exaggerated example: "Bob ran 100 meters down the hall, then turned his head at a 45 degree angle, missing the 10 meter drop into the darkness by a mere meter." Admittedly these storyboards are more evocative than that, but I still find this type of writing exhausting. On top of that the book seems to think that it is a biting critique of war, all while glorying in the capability and heroism of its characters. Banks has a lot of cool ideas, but his delivery flooded me with unnecessary details that ended up drowning out everything else.
starofterra's review against another edition
I've tried this a couple of times, but sexist SF is so boring.
urbanexodus's review against another edition
adventurous
inspiring
mysterious
tense
medium-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? A mix
- Strong character development? Yes
- Loveable characters? Yes
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? It's complicated
4.5
seanstorrs's review against another edition
3.0
I found out about The Culture novels recently and they seemed intriguing so I thought I'd give the first installment a try. The pacing was a little uneven but the book was quirky enough for me to want to read the next volume in the series.
hakansid's review against another edition
adventurous
challenging
funny
mysterious
reflective
tense
fast-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? It's complicated
- Loveable characters? No
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? It's complicated
1.0
boring sci-fi mumbo jumbo